Setup Problems ???

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VE3YF
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Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2022 10:18 pm

Setup Problems ???

Postby VE3YF » Thu Dec 22, 2022 7:55 pm

Hi:

Hope everyone is doing great for the holidays and will have a great holiday season.

Just new to this type of radio and I have a question as in my current setup, I don't think everything is correct.

I am running a Anan 7000DLE MKII.

The 7000 is fed from my home network router AC2900 (Asus AC-86U Router) and via a WiFi mesh setup to a AC1900 (Asus AC-68U Router) here in the basement, and then via 20' of CAT 8 cable from one of the AC1900 routers rear Lan ports to the 7000.

I can connect the 7000 to the network with no problems. However I am getting a steady green light and a flashing green light on the 7000 front panel. That is indicating that I am getting 100 Mbps speeds.

If I take the Cat 8 cable off the 7000 and then hook it up to a Ethernet to Thunderbolt adapter and then plug it into my MacBook Pro, I get a steady Green Light and a flashing Orange light on the adapter.

I then run Speedtest on the MacBook Pro and Wifi is turned off and Speedtest tells me I am getting a little more than 450Mbps on the Ethernet connection.

With the 450Mbps speed, is this going to be a problem, as I thought I should have higher speeds.

I am running:

Version 2.1.18
Protocol 2 (3.9)
Thetis v2.9.0.6 x64


I have not touched any of the settings on the Serial/Network Pages.

Is there something that I have overlooked. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. Tnx.

73 De Mike
VE3YF
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w-u-2-o
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Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby w-u-2-o » Thu Dec 22, 2022 8:17 pm

450Mbit/s is fast enough, but...wireless connections to any openHPSDR protocol based radios (like your Apache hardware/Thetis software) almost never work well or reliably.

The reason for this is because all audio and IF (intermediate frequency) data between the ANAN hardware and the PC hosting Thetis is sent via UDP. UDP, not being a lossless protocol, will cause significant drop out of important data if even a single UDP packet is lost.

If you are thinking "Streaming video is UDP and it works OK over wireless" that's because they can use entire seconds worth of buffering to prevent drop outs. An amateur radio needs to have very low latency in the streams it uses, only a few milliseconds, so that it's operation can be effectively real-time. Thus there is no margin for drop-outs or sharing around of connections to the wireless radios that happens normally on Wi-Fi networks.

There are some folks who have really tweaked and tuned their Wi-Fi setups, and have reduced IF bandwidths to 48KHz, in order to operate over Wi-Fi, but it's difficult, fussy and limiting to do so.

You are almost certainly going to find you want/need a wired Ethernet connection between the Apache hardware and the PC running Thetis.
VE3YF
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Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2022 10:18 pm

Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby VE3YF » Thu Dec 22, 2022 9:35 pm

Hi Scott:

So if I follow your information, basically I need to run Ethernet between my PC which is right beside the desk so that would be just a little over 6' feet away. That is not a problem and my PC has 2 x 2.5 GB Ethernet Ports. I guess I will spend the evening looking at how things work and what will the IP Address be. Stay tuned Scott I might be back in a day or 2 if I run into problem. Thanks and enjoy the holiday season.

73 De Mike
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w-u-2-o
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Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby w-u-2-o » Thu Dec 22, 2022 9:48 pm

Two NICs on the PC is perfect. See this topic: https://community.apache-labs.com/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=4127
VE3YF
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Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby VE3YF » Thu Dec 22, 2022 11:13 pm

Hi Scott:

Running into a few problems.

1. I setup the Ethernet port on the computer as suggested on Rob's (W1AEX) site to 192.168.5.1

2. Went to the link you provided which then I went an clicked on the link to download the HPSDR Programmer v2.0 Nopcap, but the link doesn't work. So I ended up downloading HPSDRProgrammer_web_v0.2.7_windows, and used the HPSDR Programmer_web program.

3. So Rob says to reconnect the LAN Cable to the Anan and then run the above program. However when I do that the program does not see the Anan which is on the router as 192.168.1.126 but it does see the newly created Ethernet Port 192.168.5.1

4. I am not sure this HPSDR Programmer is the proper one I should be using. It makes reference to Protocol 1 and I am using 2.

5. Help

73 De Mike
VE3YF
VE3YF
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Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby VE3YF » Fri Dec 23, 2022 1:16 am

Hi Scott:

Something I haven't figured out yet.

If I have given my computer's Ethernet Port an IP of 192.168.5.1, as suggested by Rob WA1AEX, and at some point I have to give the radio a IP, would 192.168.5.2 suffice.

Now since my Home Network works on 192.168.1.xxx, including my desktop computer which Thetis etc reside on, how is anything going to see the radio or the Ethernet port since they are based on 192.168.5.xxx

By no means am I an IT type guy. Ha Ha Ha.

Tnx Scott

73 De Mike
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w-u-2-o
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Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby w-u-2-o » Fri Dec 23, 2022 1:57 am

Mike,

The problem is that you DO need to be at least a marginal "network guy", and at least a marginal "Windows guy", to be comfortable with these radios. If you are not doesn't mean you can't get there, but there is a learning curve. IMHO, the skull sweat is worth it.

In order to set a static IP on the ANAN don't bother with any version of HPSDR Programmer. It's a PITA to use those. Use HPSDR Bootloader. It will work unambiguously every time, regardless of the type of firmware installed.

Bootloader (and Programmer, if you dare) instructions are here: https://community.apache-labs.com/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=2333

After Step 6 on the Bootloader instructions, use Bootloader to set the IP, not reprogram the firmware. Then jump to Step 9.

73,

Scott
VE3YF
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Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby VE3YF » Fri Dec 23, 2022 8:58 am

Hi Scott:

I read thru all the various instructions and everything worked perfect with HPSDR Bootloader and NPCAP. No problems at all. I now have 192.168.5.2 setup and working as a static IP.

Couple questions, In Thetis by default Network Watchdog was checked and I think I saw on Rob's website, he unchecks it. Also I see when Windows 10 starts up that NoCapwatchdog is now running as a startup event. Is that required or was it required just when using HPSDR Bootloader.

Other than that things seem to be running very well. (Time will tell).

Thanks for all your assistance.

73 De Mike
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w-u-2-o
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Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby w-u-2-o » Fri Dec 23, 2022 2:19 pm

Great news that you've got it working. And, now that you are conversant with Bootloader, if you ever need to upgrade the firmware you already know how to do that.

I leave Network Watchdog enabled.

As for NpCap Watchdog I don't know anything about that. I don't see that process on my installation. However, my guess is that you don't need it, not even when using Bootloader. The NpCap drivers should be present for Bootloader regardless of that watchdog process.
VE3YF
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Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby VE3YF » Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:43 pm

Hi Scott:

I disabled the NpCap Watchdog in Windows startup and no ill effects so far, and enabled Network Watchdog in Thesis. Time will tell how well things work. Thanks for all your assistance.

73 De Mike
VE3YF
WB8LBZ
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Location: El Paso, TX

Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby WB8LBZ » Fri Jan 13, 2023 9:53 pm

I have a new to me 7000 (blueface) and its not being seen on the network. DHCP is enabled by the router and the network port shows activity. HPSDRBootloader comes up with an error (missing dll). I have missed something.

73, Larry WB8LBZ
El Paso, TX
Larry, WB8LBZ
Anan 7000 sn:117 and Hermes board sn:3115
El Paso, TX
good in QRZ
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w-u-2-o
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Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby w-u-2-o » Sat Jan 14, 2023 2:40 pm

It seems like you are wanting to use Bootloader to ensure that the 7000 is set to DHCP (set address to 0.0.0.0), which is a very good idea.

If Bootloader is not working, just start over. Uninstall Bootloader, uninstall Npcap or WinPcap (whichever you used). Then restart. Then install Npcap. Restart. Then install Bootloader. Use the links provided here: viewtopic.php?f=18&t=2333
WB8LBZ
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Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby WB8LBZ » Sun Jan 15, 2023 7:25 pm

I have tried this sequence 4 times and it fails each time. I first uninstalled the npcap and HPSDRBootloader then restarted the computer. Installed the npcap and restarted the conputer. Installed HPSDRBootloader and ran it assigning an IP address of 192.168.0.141. ran IP scanning program and not finding that address in the results. Ran PowerSDR and Thetis with neither one connecting to radio. I'm out of guesses.

73, Larry WB8LBZ
El Paso, TX
Larry, WB8LBZ
Anan 7000 sn:117 and Hermes board sn:3115
El Paso, TX
good in QRZ
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w-u-2-o
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Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby w-u-2-o » Sun Jan 15, 2023 7:39 pm

I hope you didn't reinstall Bootloader 4 times! It at least seems that you did get Bootloader to run.

There are at least a couple of dozen things you might be doing wrong. You have not provided enough information to know what that might be.

It now seems like you want to set the 7000 to a static IP address whereas before you implied you wanted to use DHCP.

Step 1: describe your setup. How many NICs on your PC. How does each one get its IP address assigned? What are those IP addresses? How is the 7000 attached to the PC? Directly or via a switch? On a dedicated LAN or on the same LAN as everything else? If it's the same LAN as everything else what is the subnet of that LAN? If it's the same LAN as everything else, is 192.168.0.141 in the allowable static IP address pool?

Step 2: did you remember to flip the bootloader switch back to the normal run position and cycle power on the 7000 after that so it boot up in normal mode?
WB8LBZ
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Location: El Paso, TX

Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby WB8LBZ » Mon Jan 16, 2023 1:53 am

I did install it each time. I would check to see it it reported the MAC address and then try to give it an IP Address that was not too far from others on the network. There was no option for DHCP only a static IP. There is only one NIC on the computer I'm using. The router starts assigning IP Addresses at 192.168.0.100 so I tried the 141 and just tried 130. still no joy. A few months ago I had 4 Raspberry PI3 on the network and gave them addresses of 150, 152, 154 and 156.

For Step 2 - yes.

73, Larry WB8LBZ
El Paso, TX
Larry, WB8LBZ
Anan 7000 sn:117 and Hermes board sn:3115
El Paso, TX
good in QRZ
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w-u-2-o
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Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby w-u-2-o » Mon Jan 16, 2023 1:09 pm

WB8LBZ wrote:I did install it each time.
Well don't do that anymore! Once it is installed and working it is good. Reinstalling is not going to change anything.

I would check to see it it reported the MAC address
If it is reporting the MAC address that means the ANAN is on the network and working properly in Bootloader mode.

There was no option for DHCP only a static IP.
That is incorrect, but I agree that it's not intuitively obvious. If you use Bootloader to put in an address of 0.0.0.0 then that will enable DHCP in the ANAN.

There is only one NIC on the computer I'm using. The router starts assigning IP Addresses at 192.168.0.100
You did not fully describe how the ANAN, PC and router are all connected. I'm going to assume that they are all connected on a single, shared LAN via an Ethernet switch (perhaps the one built into the router).

so I tried the 141 and just tried 130. still no joy. A few months ago I had 4 Raspberry PI3 on the network and gave them addresses of 150, 152, 154 and 156.
That is badly wrong! :o If the router starts DHCP addressing at 0.100 then all static addresses MUST be assigned to be below 0.100. 0.99 is OK. 0.101 is not! Since the router is handing out DHCP assigned addresses above 100 by using static addresses higher than that you can accidentally be causing address conflicts on the network.

Recommendations:

1. Use Bootloader to reinstall Protocol 1 firmware into the 7000. Download the RBF file here:

https://github.com/TAPR/OpenHPSDR-Firmw ... SO_5-4.rbf

Instructions are here:

viewtopic.php?f=18&t=2333

2. Use Bootloader to put the 7000 in DHCP mode (address 0.0.0.0).

Once (if) that is working, then you can consider changing to Protocol 2 firmware. Protocol 2 firmware requires your LAN and PC to support Gigabit Ethernet.
WB8LBZ
Posts: 34
Joined: Sat May 13, 2017 3:59 am
Location: El Paso, TX

Re: Setup Problems ???

Postby WB8LBZ » Tue Jan 17, 2023 8:25 pm

I am up and running with Protocol 1. The IP address is 192.168.0.122 as was assigned by DHCP. Thanks for your assistance.

73, Larry WB8LBZ
El Paso, TX
Larry, WB8LBZ
Anan 7000 sn:117 and Hermes board sn:3115
El Paso, TX
good in QRZ

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