Transmitter specs of New G1 to be released in January 2026

[K9MB]

I am on the list for a new G1 with optional BPF and other enhsncements.
I have a question about the 3rd Order IMD spec fir the transmitter.
The specs that ANAN has published show the 3rd order IMD at -53dB on 20m at 10 watts output.
This is weird for a 100 watt rig. The G2 and other 100 watt rigs give 3rd Order IMD at 100 watts.
I have written asking about this, but no response.
No doubt, their published IMD numbers are given using Pure Signal Predistortion, but it makes no sense to publish numbers for a 100mwatt rig at inly 10 watts.
Anybody have any insight into this?
Thank you.
73, Mike K9MB

[K4IBC]

That was mis-copied from the 10E description. Scroll on down to the transmitter specs it is listed there correctly.

Where did you hear it was going to be released in January? Looks like first batch hasn't even sold out yet. I think some people are being cautious with their money.

[KC2QMA]

Is there a list of the differences between the G1 & G2 and what make them different from each other.
Just trying to figure out what the advantage & disadvantages between the two radios.

[K1LSB]

The G1 only has a single ADC receiver, so it can't do Diversity Receive.

I live in a noisy metroplex so I really need Diversity Receive, in fact on many days I couldn't operate without it.

Mark

[K9MB]

That was mis-copied from the 10E description. Scroll on down to the transmitter specs it is listed there correctly.

Where did you hear it was going to be released in January? Looks like first batch hasn't even sold out yet. I think some people are being cautious with their money.

Thanks for the info on the IMD at 100 watts.
I am almost certain that they just updated that spec at the bottom. I just looked at it two days ago and the spec was for 10 watts both places.
Seems like somebody put it up to respond to the question which I had emailed about.
You may note, however, that it just says “IMD typically -50dB, but the protocol is not standard where they specify 3rd Order IMD and a range of suppression. They do not give 5th order IMD, but specifying the close in products (3rd order) is the most important spec I think.
Really, I cannot see why they do not use the same basic amplifier as in tje G2, but the G2 has a lot more enhancements, so the IMD be better. No doubt, these are Pure Signal pecs, but it would be nice if they gave the specs without predistortion, which are likely closer to -30dB 3rd Order IMD.
Maybe they will clean this up soon.
I am in the first shipment batch and had upgraded from a 10E order and added the Bandpass filter and low noise 6 meter LNA option, so it is getting pricey at about $2k.
That is why I am asking more questions myself
The bandwidth limit of 192KHz vs 384khz is a little disappointing, but not a deal killer.

To amswer yiur question, I got a letter Thursday saying that the first batch would ship in January (yeah-right!!) so it will not be long until they begin shipping.
But the letter mostly was about the added BPF in receive plus more port options and a LNA for 6 meters as a $200 add-on and they wanted to know if I was opting in or out of the upgrade.
This tells me that they are fabricating and writing firmware, so it is happening. They also said that there would be a free two year warranty for pre-orders.
That can be satisfying or alarming, depending on exoectations firmthe first batch…

[K9MB]

Is there a list of the differences between the G1 & G2 and what make them different from each other.
Just trying to figure out what the advantage & disadvantages between the two radios.

The G2 has better 3rd order IMD on transmit and the bsndwidth displayed goes up to 384khz vs 192khz
It also gives full diversity as well I think with two processors.
It is 2x as expensive for a reason, but I do not want to spend $4k+ for a radio and can live without diversity phase cancellation capability.

[w-u-2-o]

The G1 only has a single ADC receiver, so it can't do Diversity Receive.

That's really the only significant difference. If PureSignal is being used then the transmitter IMD performance differences between models starting with the old ANAN-200D and newer are pretty much insignificant in practice. Which one is the "best" is only going to be noticed on the lab bench, not in any real-world scenario.

It would appear that, recently, G1 position holders received an email that said the G1 would ship in two different configurations. These are with and without the BPF (preselector) and 6M LNA. Other than the LNA, IMHO that's also not a significant difference as the 3rd order BPF designs used in all prior models don't amount to very much preselection. Indeed, I always use bypass on both my 100D and 8000DLE.

The G2 has better 3rd order IMD on transmit and the bsndwidth displayed goes up to 384khz vs 192khz

The maximum bandwidth available will depend on which firmware you install (or that comes installed). I'm very confident that BOTH P1 and P2 will be supported on the G1. The current version of Thetis supports P1 and P2 on ALL models all the way back to the original ANAN-10 as follows:

- With P1 firmware, ONLY 192 KHz is supported.
- With P2 firmware up to 1536 KHz is supported.

[K9MB]

The G1 only has a single ADC receiver, so it can't do Diversity Receive.

That's really the only significant difference. If PureSignal is being used then the transmitter IMD performance differences between models starting with the old ANAN-200D and newer are pretty much insignificant in practice. Which one is the "best" is only going to be noticed on the lab bench, not in any real-world scenario.

It would appear that, recently, G1 position holders received an email that said the G1 would ship in two different configurations. These are with and without the BPF (preselector) and 6M LNA. Other than the LNA, IMHO that's also not a significant difference as the 3rd order BPF designs used in all prior models don't amount to very much preselection. Indeed, I always use bypass on both my 100D and 8000DLE.

The G2 has better 3rd order IMD on transmit and the bsndwidth displayed goes up to 384khz vs 192khz

The maximum bandwidth available will depend on which firmware you install (or that comes installed). I'm very confident that BOTH P1 and P2 will be supported on the G1. The current version of Thetis supports P1 and P2 on ALL models all the way back to the original ANAN-10 as follows:

- With P1 firmware, ONLY 192 KHz is supported.
- With P2 firmware up to 1536 KHz is supported.

Thank you, Scott for the information.
I wonder if you can explain why you turn iff the 3rd order BPFs in your other equipment?
3rd order filters are certainly not sharp, but I had guessed that they may help in out of band local signal increased intermod from overload and saturation that reduces dynamic range, say- an AM station a few miles away affecting 160 or 80 meter weak signal performance. 160 is a bad example, however, I understand…
You must think that they actually cause some degradation rather than enhancement of the overall performance in a dense electromagnetic environment?
This is a real question- not questioning your choice, but trying to understand it better.
I told them I wanted the BPF and LNA, but if it is useless, why pay $200 extra?
By the way- what is the noise figure of the 6 meter front ends without LNA added?
At 6 meters, the noise figure needs to be higher than about 4dB to benefit from a low noise amp, plus- any preamp will degrade the high signal level IMD of the receiver in a signal dense environme t like channel 2-6 tv or FM cose by, plus an LNA must have a gain of at least 10dB higher than the native front end noise figure or it will do little good. If the frint end is 7dB like ring mixers,mthe you really want an LNA witj 17-20dB gain to take advantage of the low noise figure if the LNA, plus a high dynamic range LNA is only part of a solution, because the first stage after it (mixer must be wven higher dynamic range or it will make thi gs worse in high signal density environment.
Let me jnow why the 3rd order BPF are a negative though, so I can decide for sure if I want them or not. Thank you. 73, MB

[laurencebarker]

There is a further difference between G1 and G2: G1 has an Intel Cyclone FPGA; G2 has the Xilinx FPGA and Raspberry pi processor. G1 will not run piHPSDR internally.

[w-u-2-o]

Thank you, Scott for the information.
I wonder if you can explain why you turn iff the 3rd order BPFs in your other equipment?

Because of their minimal performance as a preselector, and because of the additional complexity they entail when using RX1 and RX2 on the same ADC but on different bands, I've found it far more convenient to turn them off. And, as our radios have excellent dynamic range and IIP3 performance, this has never resulted in any sort of interference or overload effects in my experience. However, I am located in a relatively rural area with no nearby sources of HF or broadcast band energy.

To provide another benchmark, even with signals of S9+40 on band "x", when I'm operating on band "y" I notice no difference with the BPF on or off.

Yet another interesting observation cam with the advent of the "Wideband" (WB) display. Enabling and disabling the BPF did not show me much difference across the entire HF spectrum.

A third observation is that folks with radios that have no preselection BFPs, e.g. the -10, -10E, HL2, rarely, if ever, complain about that lack.

Of course "your mileage may vary". If you have a nearby interferer, perhaps every bit might help. If you take your radio to field day or a multi-op contest site, all bets are off. If your problem is BCB interference, a dedicated BCB filter will do a much better job than the BFPs in the Apache designs.

With regard to the LNA, I am not a 6M operator. Therefore I can't provide any opinion based on operational experience. However, I suspect that the LNA is valuable on 6M. Perhaps others will chime in with their results on 6M.

[w-u-2-o]

There is a further difference between G1 and G2: G1 has an Intel Cyclone FPGA; G2 has the Xilinx FPGA and Raspberry pi processor. G1 will not run piHPSDR internally.

That difference is a double-edged sword. The care and feeding of the G2 has proven to be substantially more complex, requiring management of firmware, middleware and the Pi operating system to keep the radio working. This is a lot of extra work for folks who are using it with Thetis.

[K9MB]

Thank you, Scott for the information.
I wonder if you can explain why you turn iff the 3rd order BPFs in your other equipment?

Because of their minimal performance as a preselector, and because of the additional complexity they entail when using RX1 and RX2 on the same ADC but on different bands, I've found it far more convenient to turn them off. And, as our radios have excellent dynamic range and IIP3 performance, this has never resulted in any sort of interference or overload effects in my experience. However, I am located in a relatively rural area with no nearby sources of HF or broadcast band energy.

To provide another benchmark, even with signals of S9+40 on band "x", when I'm operating on band "y" I notice no difference with the BPF on or off.

Yet another interesting observation cam with the advent of the "Wideband" (WB) display. Enabling and disabling the BPF did not show me much difference across the entire HF spectrum.

A third observation is that folks with radios that have no preselection BFPs, e.g. the -10, -10E, HL2, rarely, if ever, complain about that lack.

Of course "your mileage may vary". If you have a nearby interferer, perhaps every bit might help. If you take your radio to field day or a multi-op contest site, all bets are off. If your problem is BCB interference, a dedicated BCB filter will do a much better job than the BFPs in the Apache designs.

With regard to the LNA, I am not a 6M operator. Therefore I can't provide any opinion based on operational experience. However, I suspect that the LNA is valuable on 6M. Perhaps others will chime in with their results on 6M.

Thank you again, Scott for the detailed explanation. I have zero experience with SDR systems. My last rig that I operated actively was a Kenwood Twins R599-T599 driving a home brew 4x811a amp. It had discreet bipolar and dual gate mosfets at low level and the ubiquitous 12by7 driving a pair of 6146b finals. -30dB third order IMD was a dream, but practical operation was to not overdrive the amp and have someone check +-10khz to see if the signsl was wide or any pops and aliens were heard…. Predistortion was not even dreamed of in my world which started in 1965…

I did sprnd a lot of years building low noise receivers for 2 meters, 220 amd 440mHz and those receivers were often used in urban environments where desense was a challenge
High dynamic range mixers and low noise front ends that had good BPF were essential.
I have never worked 6 meters because it inevitably alienated neighbors who liked channels 2-6 and we were in a fringe area. No meed to mrntikn that their TV front ends were crap. Safer to insult their dog!

From your comments, I may forego the BPF and 6m LNA and save the $200.
73, MB

[w-u-2-o]

Thank you again, Scott for the detailed explanation. I have zero experience with SDR systems.

You are going to be amazed at the performance, both receive and transmit. This goes for all direct-sampling architecture HF transceivers from any manufacturer, not just the G1.

A couple of cautionary notes:

1. It is extremely easy to get overwhelmed with the HUGE number of settings, options and functions in Thetis. These are the dream radios for experimenters, tweakers, and those who want to really dive in. In particular, when properly set up, there are NO radios that sound better on the air. And they do a lot of things NO other radio can do. Expect a steep learning curve. But there are plenty of Thetis Elmers here and on the air. What's really cool is if you can get a buddy to remote into your PC to actually help you operate from time to time and show you things you didn't know existed in the software (no, I am not available ).

2. Remember that Apache only sells the hardware. All of the firmware and software (Thetis, or piHPSDR if you are a die-hard Linux person) comes from the free open source software (FOSS) world and are 100% developed by just a very small group of volunteer developers who do it for the love of the hobby. If the hardware breaks you can try to get warrantee service from Apache. If the software is acting up this is the place to get help from your fellow Apache owners (or the FB group, or Reddit, or Discord, but this is by far the greatest concentration of people).

[K9MB]

Thank you again, Scott for the detailed explanation. I have zero experience with SDR systems.

You are going to be amazed at the performance, both receive and transmit. This goes for all direct-sampling architecture HF transceivers from any manufacturer, not just the G1.

A couple of cautionary notes:

1. It is extremely easy to get overwhelmed with the HUGE number of settings, options and functions in Thetis. These are the dream radios for experimenters, tweakers, and those who want to really dive in. In particular, when properly set up, there are NO radios that sound better on the air. And they do a lot of things NO other radio can do. Expect a steep learning curve. But there are plenty of Thetis Elmers here and on the air. What's really cool is if you can get a buddy to remote into your PC to actually help you operate from time to time and show you things you didn't know existed in the software (no, I am not available ).

2. Remember that Apache only sells the hardware. All of the firmware and software (Thetis, or piHPSDR if you are a die-hard Linux person) comes from the free open source software (FOSS) world and are 100% developed by just a very small group of volunteer developers who do it for the love of the hobby. If the hardware breaks you can try to get warrantee service from Apache. If the software is acting up this is the place to get help from your fellow Apache owners (or the FB group, or Reddit, or Discord, but this is by far the greatest concentration of people).

Thanks, Scott for the summary of what I am looking at. I never did anything that I knew how to do before, so nothing new, but this looks challenging for sure.
I had to laugh when you said you would not devote all your time to hand feed it to me…l
You are extremely generous to put a border around it and give solid advice, so that is a great deal to me. I promise I will not show up and try to move in your basement..
It sounds like great fun to find my way with occasional help from generous and kind expertd in this field. The guys that write the code for this are brillisnt, no doubt. My idea is to try to learn to load and run their firmware.

I am very excited by the challenge. Cannot wait to get started. 73, MB

[dj1yr]

...These are with and without the BPF (preselector) and 6M LNA. Other than the LNA, IMHO that's also not a significant difference as the 3rd order BPF designs used in all prior models don't amount to very much preselection. Indeed, I always use bypass on both my 100D and 8000DLE.

That's not true, all Anan 100/D/B and 200D had the good filter, which was HPSDR Alex.
It was only from Anan 7000 onwards that Apache used simple band filters for the receivers.